Loot systeem : EPGP

Concreet :

Introduction Loot Systeem EPGP

Our looting rules and detailed information about the system, EPGP, we use.

Purpose of EPGP:
Provides a fair way to distribute loot based on specific and transparent criteria.
Some features of the EPGP system:

- Share loot based on participation.
- Eliminate incentives to hoard or compete with other members.
- Reward good etiquette in raids and in the guild.
- Reward boss kills, even if loot is disenchanted.
- Encourage attempts through all the wipes for new bosses.

What is EPGP:

It is a way to distribute items in 25-man instances based on a "Priority" system. When items drop, each item is given to the bidding player of proper class and spec with the highest Priority. There are no rolls and there is no DKP to "spend", although your Priority functions similarly to the way DKP does in a fixed-price system (person with the most gets the item).

EPGP means Effort Points (EP) / Gear Points (GP). EP is awarded for your actions and increases your Priority. GP is the value of the loot you've won and reduces your Priority. Your Priority is your EP divided by your GP, so when your EP goes up, your Priority goes up and when your GP goes up, your Priority goes down.

Unlike the DKP systems in which you "bank" points and spend them on gear, you instead have two running totals -- EP and GP -- that both go up. Because Priority is a ratio of the two numbers instead of subtracting one from the other, EP is not tied to gear values and can be awarded for anything you do that the guild values, as you'll see further below.

Every item's GP is calculated from its item level and slot. The EPGP Wiki explains the formula to calculate GP. The EPGP addon will show you the GP value of any item in-game so you can see the GP of your own gear, gear in AH, other player's gear, and gear that drops off bosses.

EP is awarded as "Earned EP" during raids and as "Bonus EP" for other actions you take. The types of EP awarded and their relative values can been seen further below.

For a detailed explanation of the system, see EPGP Wiki . For more description and to download the in-game addon, go to their Google project

Start up Effort Points:
Everyone starts at 0 EP and 100 GP as a Baseline and works up to the minimum for item awards, 5000 EP .

How to ern effort points:
- Signed up on the guild calendar and show up for raid on time. +200 EP
- On time bonus. +50 EP
- +50 EP (10 man - Every 15 minutes while in the raid. +50 EP (10 Man)
- +100 EP (25 man - Every 15 minutes while in the raid. +100 EP (25 Man)
- New Boss kills 2000 EP
- Boss Kills 500 EP
Members that have been left out of the raid due to no spots will also be awarded

How to lose effort points:
In addition to earning EP, you can also be penalized EP.
Whenever you do something that makes the raid leader wants to slap you, you get a penalty.
For each penalty you get a deduction in effort points and after your 3rd penalty also removal from the raid.

- First penalty: -100 EP
- Second penalty: -200 EP
- Third penalty: -300 EP and removal from the raid.
- Sign up for raid, and not show up -250 EP
- Go AFK more then 15 Min / without warning -150 EP

So no unannounced AFK or being AFK for more than half hour and such kind of thing that messes up the raid for the rest.

How to win equipment:
When a piece of gear drops in an instance, all players of the correct class Rank and spec can bid on it if they have at least 5000 EP .

The Order of Class Ranks are Core Raiders 1st Priortiy

Part Time Raiders 2nd Priortiy

Trial Raiders 3rd Priortiy

The player with the highest priority wins - there will be no rolls. That player's GP will be updated and Priority will be recalculated.

You cannot bid on an item if you don't have at least 5000 EP , although you can win an item if no one above 5000 EP bids on it. If your EP drops below 5000 EP due to Decay or by being penalized, you must work your EP back up.
This requires raiders to participate frequently if they want gear rather than cherry-picking their raids. It also prevents one-time raiders from getting gear.

What Decay is:
As you earn more gear, your GP could grow quite large. Even though your EP grows quickly, your Priority drops faster because your EP is divided by your large GP. So after a few pieces of gear, you might not be able to get another piece for a few months.

This is resolved by a "Decay" factor. After each raid, your EP and GP will both be reduced by the "Decay Factor", which is currently 10%, in other words diminished by 10%. Your Priority won't change because both EP and GP are reduced by the same proportion. The Decay Factor allows your new EP awards to increase your Priority faster than it would have otherwise. The Decay also provides incentive to bid on gear rather than trying to keep it high by "hoarding EP" because it will go down over time.

Because of the Decay factor, it is usually better to win a piece of gear than to wait for something better.

Dit zal het gaan worden. Laat maar horen wat je er van denkt
Van tijd tot tijd zullen we proberen een overzicht te posten op het forum

is there gonna be some use of a program ? cause that a fucking lot of work....

Incy wrote:is there gonna be some use of a program ? cause that a fucking lot of work....

ofc there is

EPGP addon

First Try : 20.00 - 22.30 ==> 8*15 min ==> 50EP5min ==> 400
Decay : 10% ==> 40
REST : 400 - 40 = 360. Everyone Starts with 100 GP

Name EP GP PR
Spanks 360 100 3.6
Tibrak 360 100 3.6
Wipmi 360 100 3.6
Grudge 360 100 3.6
Shaved 360 100 3.6
Badhor 360 100 3.6
Slay 360 100 3.6
Wolfke 360 100 3.6
Blood 360 100 3.6
Santakl 360 100 3.6

Raid 2 : 20.15 - 23.00 ==> 11 * 15 ==> 550 + 2000 = 2550 EP
New Boss kill = 2000
same boss from second time on = 500
10% decay ==> 2550 - 255 = 2295

GP = (item value)² x 0.04 x slot value
slot value wrist : 0.55
itemvalue = (ilvl - 1.3)/1.3
((359-1,3)/1,3)² *0,55*0,04 + 100 = 1765

Name EP GP Pr.
Spanks 360 + 2295 100 26.55
Tibrak 360 + 2295 100 26.55
Wipmi 360 + 2295 100 26.55
Grudge 360 + 2295 100 26.55
Blood 360 + 2295 100 26.55
Santakl 360 + 2295 100 26.55
Badhor 360 + 2295 100 26.55
Texaco 2295 100 22.95
Harl 2295 100 22.95
Jarich 2295 1765 1.299 ==> 1.3


mvg
Slaybeard

what the heeeeeel? daar versta ik dus geen zak van

one question not that concerns me but what about offspec and mainspec?

Interesting system.

I have a few questions about the decay factor:
1) Isn't decay supposed to be applied both to EP and GP, so that your priority remains unchanged? If I follow your calculations, you only reduced EP.
2) To whom exactly is the decay applied? I suppose to those - and only those - that earned some EP, otherwise you may be inclined to simply skip a few raids when your priority is very low so that the decay factor kicks in several times and makes the next EP gains more interesting.

And I hope for you that this addon works and does all these calculations for you, or else you'll get crazy

nice system, is it going to accesable trough a site ? that you can see how much you have?

While we're at it, maybe we could use a similar system to avoid confusion and guild drama when people don't get a raid slot.

Each player has two values: the number of raids he signed up for and the effective number of raids he participated in. The ratio of these two numbers would determine that player's priority over other players with similar roles when joining raids. A decay factor would also be applied to emphasize recent raid activity over older events.

That is the idea of the existing system. You only get decay if you participate, so not participating means no decay, hence you automatically rise a bit in the ranks.

2000 punten voor 1ste boss kill!!!! als iemand mee dagen aan het whipen heeft geweest en die kan 1 keer niet en dan gaat die boss neer worden ze gestraft voor het zegge want door toedoen van die persoon die mee aan het whipen heeft geweest gaat die boss neer maar dan ken je juist die dag ni meegaan is er een vervanger en die krygt dan 2000 punten thats not right srr new boss kill or not het zou geen verschil mogen maken in points en als je gaat zegge dat mensen meer gemotiveerd zyn omdat ze meer punten krygen dan zyn het geen raiders maar je weet wel de motivatie en voldoening zou moete zyn die baas neerleggen en niet de motivatie uit de points halen dit moest ik even kwyt





GREETZ DE LAFAARD

ik snap wat je bedoelt. miss moet er een increase zijn in punten die je krijgt bij wipen op "new" bosses. en krijgen de mensen die singen en niet mee kunnen omdat de raid vol zit ook deze punten? dit is in zekere zin niet eerlijk voor die mensen.

This system (well, a slightly simplied version of it) has been in use since januari. It's the existing EPGP system, not something we've made up. So I guess it makes sence if so many other guilds are using it. I think the idea behind the 'first time boss downed'-bonus is that most of the time, the people that achieved this ARE the ones who have been wiping the most on it, learning the tactics, etc. And they are given a bonus to represent their efforts and for passing on their wisdom to the others.

Check here for our version of the EPGP: Ordo Malificum's EPGP

ja maar de mensen die wipen op een nieuwe baas en bij de volgende fight niet meekunnen(door priority systeem) krijgen niks en missen dus de volle 2k punten.
dit lijkt in mijn ogen niet fair? of zit ik verkeerd?

miss een bepaalde vergoeding voor de mensen die niet meekonden die raid maar wel ingeschreven staan?

Well I was in the first attempts to kill Omnitron and was left out yesterday because of the priority system. That doesn't mean I'm crying for lost points or loot. It's how it works and I'm pretty sure everyone gave its best to achieve the kill each time, so rather than rant about that, I'd prefer to give kudos to yesterday raid members

And just so you notice :
- Lafaard : up to now, you're the only dps leather in raids, so no one else on that loot, stop crying about a few points. And you did get the bonus points on the other bosses btw... so at that time the system was right? Tsk tsk.
- Haya : starting subscribing to raids would maybe give a bit more weights to your arguments.

And those rules didn't spawn last night, they've always been there, just contesting them when you find them unfitting for your case does not seem right.

i'm alsow a leather wearer who needs agy and stam!!!! xD

Spanks wrote:
And just so you notice :
- Lafaard : up to now, you're the only dps leather in raids, so no one else on that loot.

wel i didn't know i could go with group one because there was talk of a second group.
and a person that doesn't raid has less to say?
just saying there are some holes in the system.

grtz haya

gurdius wrote:i'm alsow a leather wearer who needs agy and stam!!!! xD

Seeing the difference between tanking plate and dps plate, I'd guess there's the same for leather... or then druids are OP and I'll switch to Gyrfalcon

And yes Haya, even if it seems politically incorrect to say that, I do think people not raiding have less rights to complain about the raiding system. And yes, you're welcome to the raids, there was enough talk about that during Sunday raid.

Just for those who missed the aforementioned discussion on Sunday: everybody who wants to raid is welcome and even encouraged to do so; we simply don't have enough players to create two separate raid groups at the moment. Moreover, with the current priority system, you are almost guaranteed to have a raid slot on your first subscription and will not be penalized because of your low raid attendance.

hmm just to notice i so it today the thing about the points and they may cut my points in previous bosses i dont care about loot. only when im on the pvp boss i care about loot and just to notice im the first one that want to pass it so i dont care about points the only thing i care about that it has to go fair and downing the boss ofcourse thats my main care and whiping days on a boss and you cant participate for one or another reason and the boss goes down and becuasse of the effort that the person has done another gets rewarded its not that fair i think and i know the loot systems is already integraded in the guild its becuasse someone posted here a reply today that i was reading some stuff here so i respond to it maybe late but beter late then never. and saying im QQing hmm im the last to QQ but i just say how i think about it i dont care about points i even find the best loot system is loot council no points but poeple dont like loot council. for me its hard to type my feelings about it thats why i almost never respond on forum becuasse my typing is neutral so if you wanna talk more about it whit me come on vent and discuss there much eassier to express myself i hope this make things a little duidelyker



greetz lafaard









qq

Spanks wrote:I do think people not raiding have less rights to complain

k al hoewel dees niet echt een "raiding" guild is, zal ik nie meer zage tot ik wa met jullie heb geraid .

I decided to forgo lengthy discussions about who deserves what and so on, plus the calculations are already complex enough as they are, so now there's no more bonus for killing a boss for the first time. Just 500 EP whenever u succesfully down a boss. Always. The scores have been updated to reflect this.

Spanks wrote:

gurdius wrote:i'm alsow a leather wearer who needs agy and stam!!!! xD

And yes Haya, even if it seems politically incorrect to say that, I do think people not raiding have less rights to complain about the raiding system. And yes, you're welcome to the raids, there was enough talk about that during Sunday raid.

Well i do not !

The raiding system was also designed to encourage people to join in raids.
Changing rules without the voice of the members is doomed to go wrong.
This is not an anarchy.

Second of all for the moment i do not have the time to raid. but i do understand his point. You can join up for 10 raids and wipe every time end then 1 raid you cant join up but the boss goes down according to previous rules you're 10 times were worth nothing.

And last but not least We are a semicore raiding guild, struggling to survive and we need every member ingame. So we also need every ones opinion not just ... yours.

Grudgebeard wrote:I decided to forgo lengthy discussions about who deserves what and so on, plus the calculations are already complex enough as they are, so now there's no more bonus for killing a boss for the first time. Just 500 EP whenever u succesfully down a boss. Always. The scores have been updated to reflect this.

Works for me.

You maybe can upload the formula or excel file so no discussions can be made about cheating and so all. (i have faith but some may have no faith...)

If people don't trust me enough to do the math correctly, they can suck my jeeves ^^